unfair competition?

Ok so lets get along together, I'm going to give another company my $5000 client because we should be friends.....yeah right.

Competition drives the industry forward.

Your territory? I'm sorry, but I have no idea how the hell you can call yourself an artist or a freelancer....you're a mouse among men here.

Originally Posted by Rimfire You are right about the fact that most do not have families to support, but then again what makes you think you can support a family offering freelance design work or trying to sell your paintings? My suggestion to you would be to get a real job if you do not already have one. Do not rely on freelance work to pay the bills, think of it as a pastime that will generate a small amount of income or "Pocket Money"; Not as your sole source of the green stuff.

I support myself quite well with freelancing. I take offense to you implying it's not a "real job." If it's not for you, I'd have to make a reasonable assumption that you're not good enough at it, in a business sense, to have the same reality. Freelancing is business just like any other job. If you're just looking at it as pocket money then you're obviously not taking it as seriously as a lot of us here do. Doing freelance work part-time because you want to is perfectly fine. But acting in a condescending way towards someone who intends to make it their living is unacceptable and arrogant.

Originally Posted by resolva Infact it is illegal to put prices whatever you want. Its called unfair competition. The reason why nothing is done is because most freelance designers are not registered which means you can't complain.

I'm not sure where you're coming from, so maybe things are different for you. But in the US, there is absolutely nothing illegal about putting your prices wherever you want. There is no such thing as "unfair competition" unless you're referring to monopolies. This is in no way the case here. And not being registered does NOT mean you can't complain if you have a legitimate grievance. You don't have to be registered as a business to freelance. But you still report your income and pay taxes (unless of course you're breaking the law), and have the same recourse for most problems that registered businesses do.

This is simply capitalism at work. You need to have a balance between quality and price that makes you competitive in the market. If someone can offer a service for $5 and you charge $45, you better make up for it by having increased quality or extra perks for the client. Do you have to spend $60,000 on a car? No. Do some people do it? Of course they do. If you're having problems with your prices, you're likely not targeting the right potential clients. Too many freelancers try to operate without a business and marketing plan. You need to evaluate your competition FIRST, and then again every year or two. If you can't compete, or if the market is saturated, you need to find another field or a way to appeal to a smaller niche market. That's basic business. If you can't handle basic business issues (including legal issues like you mentioned here) then you shouldn't be freelancing at all; at least not if you take it seriously.

jenn alot of things that you are saying makes sense...it si true that if you wanna play the game you have to know the rules and then you can choose.
do i want to abide by them or go around them.
the consequences varies.
going around them could be consider illigal but the law of the market is that their is no law when we talking about competition it becomes ok to kill , if that what it is required in order to go foward, well that's where i desagree .quality is job number one ...for me and you cannot get quality cheap. quality cannot compromise on the rules of competition. so do we have to get out if we cannot take the heat ....i dont think so
We can fight and open the window.
i love you guys you force me into phylosophy/poetry!lol

Agreed. Quality is not always important to competitors, and that's why they're able to offer services so cheap. The point then is that you would need to make quality your platform, and worry less about price. People will pay more for high quality. Just prove to customers that your quality is worth the price you're charging them. As an example: Victoria's Secret charges somewhat high prices for lingerie. You could also buy lingerie at Walmart for about 1/10 of the price. Where would most people prefer to buy lingerie? Well, if they can afford it, they'll generally go to Victoria's Secret even though they'll pay more. They don't care about prices, because they know the quality is immensely better. Perhaps your real problem is in branding yourself. If you brand yourself and your work appropriately for your target market (higher-end clients who are willing to pay more for better quality services) you'll attract more clients willing to pay your higher rates.

Originally Posted by jhmattern I support myself quite well with freelancing. I take offense to you implying it's not a "real job." If it's not for you, I'd have to make a reasonable assumption that you're not good enough at it, in a business sense, to have the same reality. Freelancing is business just like any other job. If you're just looking at it as pocket money then you're obviously not taking it as seriously as a lot of us here do. Doing freelance work part-time because you want to is perfectly fine. But acting in a condescending way towards someone who intends to make it their living is unacceptable and arrogant.

Yes, you support yourself but that is not what I was talking about at all. I was talking about supporting a family which would be very difficult, and alot different than just having yourself to look after. Once you have even one more mouth to feed, clothe, and provide a roof for I am sure it will be alot harder to do; That is to say, unless you have big name clients amongst the likes of Pepsi, Sony, etc. Sorry that you did not understand that I was talking about zprod attempting to support his family trying to sell his artwork and not just himself.

As a matter of fact, I do take freelance design seriously. Just not in the same way as you. You may take it seriously because you enjoy producing and developing clean looking/smooth running websites, as well as knowing that this is how you will pay your bills. But just because I am not going to rely on freelance design to pay my bills, does not mean I do not take it in the same seriousness as you in terms of producing/developing website that I can be proud of.

I didn't take the time to read all of the other posts due to the fact that they looked like flaming, etc. However, here is my response to the oringal post.

I've noticed this same problem you speak of. However, it is just free business. They are just finding a way to get the work over you--it happens everywhere--if you can't deal with it, you should be an employee.

I personally suggest you market towards a local market, instead of an internet market. It's much easier to deal with a smaller market that you can study and become well involved in.

Another way to combat dealing with others moving in on your current markets is to work more towards an unique niche, instead of working with the usual normal.

Originally Posted by Rimfire Yes, you support yourself but that is not what I was talking about at all. I was talking about supporting a family which would be very difficult, and alot different than just having yourself to look after. Once you have even one more mouth to feed, clothe, and provide a roof for I am sure it will be alot harder to do; That is to say, unless you have big name clients amongst the likes of Pepsi, Sony, etc. Sorry that you did not understand that I was talking about zprod attempting to support his family trying to sell his artwork and not just himself. As a matter of fact, I do take freelance design seriously. Just not in the same way as you. You may take it seriously because you enjoy producing and developing clean looking/smooth running websites, as well as knowing that this is how you will pay your bills. But just because I am not going to rely on freelance design to pay my bills, does not mean I do not take it in the same seriousness as you in terms of producing/developing website that I can be proud of.

I don't support just me. I make far more over the median household income in my area. You absolutely do NOT need big name clients like Pepsi, Sony, etc. to support a family. lol Most freelancers who support a family do so with numerous small clients. It's about knowing how to be a good businessperson, knowing how to set your rates appropriately, and knowing how to market yourself to proper potential clients who can afford the rates you intend to charge.

I don't do freelance web design. I do freelance writing, editing, and PR / Publicity work. I'm also an expert in consulting and freelance in general, covering the topic formerly for The NY Times Company's About.com, and currently for another site network. So I am very well aware of what it takes to be successful in any kind of freelance work, and those are the things I mentioned above. I didn't say you didn't take web design (or the quality of your work seriously). All of my comments are in reference to the business of freelancing.

Originally Posted by Shawon may be unfair, but thats life and thats business. it's competition, there's no law against having low prices.

In fact, there are laws against having low prices. At least, in Canada there is. The difficult part is that since developers work remotely from all over the world and there is no "global" government, how do you take legal action?

Originally Posted by kork In fact, there are laws against having low prices. At least, in Canada there is. The difficult part is that since developers work remotely from all over the world and there is no "global" government, how do you take legal action?

In this case though, the original poster is from New York, and in the US there aren't any such laws against low prices.

I'm not really sure about Canadian law, but that's interesting to know.