Today's Posts Follow Us On Twitter! TFL Members on Twitter  
Forum search: Advanced Search  
Navigation
Marketplace
  Members Login:
Lost password?
  Forum Statistics:
Forum Members: 24,254
Total Threads: 80,792
Total Posts: 566,471
There are 863 users currently browsing (tf).
 
  Our Partners:
 
  TalkFreelance     Business and Website Management     Contracts, Business and Legal Help :

My quest for a web designer continues!

Thread title: My quest for a web designer continues!
Closed Thread  
Page 2 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >
    Thread tools Search this thread Display Modes  
04-21-2006, 06:23 PM
#11
Anthony is offline Anthony
Status: Sin Binner
Join date: Jul 2004
Location: Yorkshire Coast - UK
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 5,911
iTrader: 29 / 91%
 

Anthony is on a distinguished road

Send a message via MSN to Anthony

  Old

Can't wait to see what it turns out like mate, best of luck with it all. Let me know when that sexy blog of yours launches

04-22-2006, 05:52 AM
#12
TylerL is offline TylerL
TylerL's Avatar
Status: Sin Binner
Join date: Nov 2004
Location: Sudbury, Ontario
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 270
iTrader: 0 / 0%
 

TylerL is on a distinguished road

Send a message via MSN to TylerL

  Old

Originally Posted by Robson
Hello everyone and good morning

A couple of weeks ago I gave myself a challenge to track down a new web designer for a couple of upcoming projects. The short list were....

www.vbulletinskinz.com
www.webrhinostudios.com
www.4design.tv
www.webinc.com (adult web design, warning!)

So far, all but webinc have responded (with shelton from vbulletinskinz e-mailing me with a quote after nearly 14 days since my original e-mail!) That didn't go in his favour.....not to mention the numerous stories i've heard about him being late with other web projects. Anyway, I just finished speaking with him and to be perfectly blunt, he didn't seem that "professional" or didn't wish to answer a simple question regarding how he came up with the price of my project.....

The first company to respond was webrhinostudios, whilst they look the part and were very prompt with their reply I have heard some stories from a few disgruntled customers that's made me think twice, coupled with a slightly more expensive budget (pushing the $2k mark for a 2 page psd! But still a few hundred lower than vbulletinskinz!).

So that was two designers firmly marked off my list....

However, a light at the end of the tunnel perhaps? www.4design.tv have quoted me a very competitive price for web design They have communicated very professionaly and promptly and have answered all my questions......they have even provided me with a very professional contract outlining the delivery times/terms and conditions etc.

So, my decision has been made and the first venture on the web since selling Talkfreelance will be designed by www.4design.tv, you can check out updates regarding this and other projects on my new blog www.robertryall.com which will be coming this weekend (fingers crossed!).
Great choice Robson, she's an awesome designer! Be sure to keep me in mind next time.

04-22-2006, 01:46 PM
#13
depthskins is offline depthskins
depthskins's Avatar
Status: I love this place
Join date: Apr 2006
Location: Canada
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 699
iTrader: 0 / 0%
 

depthskins is on a distinguished road

Send a message via MSN to depthskins Send a message via Yahoo to depthskins Send a message via Skype™ to depthskins

  Old

I think you've made a good selection. 4design.tv has a really great portfolio and from what you're said, the seem professional enough.

Good luck! And I'm looking forward to see your website/blog.

04-29-2006, 05:32 PM
#14
ShytKicker is offline ShytKicker
ShytKicker's Avatar
Status: Member
Join date: Dec 2005
Location:
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 143
iTrader: 0 / 0%
 

ShytKicker is on a distinguished road

  Old

Please stay away from Vbulletinskinz.com. I had deposited $3000 to his account almost 2 months ago for 3 skins for sqlforums.com, xbox360talk.com, and csstalk.com.

First off, he kept delaying with just the mock design. Then after he couldn't get it done day after day, he just blocked me. I had a feeling he blocked me so I had a buddy add him to MSN and my buddy was reporting everything everyday. The guy has been on daily almost 24/7, while showing offline on my MSN list.

I emailed him. No response. I emailed him again, no response. Now it was 3 weeks after mock design was due, and I emailed him a third time, saying he has 30 minutes to respond to the email. He responded saying he sent out the mock design the day before to my email address. I said, I never received it. This was such a dumb lie on his part, how can I get every email from his email address, and not get the one that had the skin. So I told him to resend it. He said it in his office at work. I said, what's the difference, log into your email account via Home, go to Sent Mail, and forward to my email again. He said it was in Outlook. (Another dumb lie because Outlook always has to be connected to a POP/SMAP mail account). He told me he'll resend it tomorrow at work and told me to be on MSN then. I go on MSN the next day, he isn't online. I send him an email that night, and he said he sent it to my email account. I never received it. He said, "Oh, this time I brought USB drive with me home, so I have it on here, I'll resend it now". I said okay, resend it.

He takes 10 minutes, then he sends me the skin. What does he send me? An old skin he used for past clients that was denied, and he said it was purposely designed for sqlforums.com. This is the skin he sent:

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a3...Kicker/sql.gif

I asked him, why does it say Deuce Ace (past client) at the bottom of that skin? Where is the logo? Why is there a weight-loss sample banner? Why is all the text about Raw Food Chat (another past client). He said it was mock text, and that this skin was purposely made for sqlforums.com. I told him, how could it possibly been made for sqlforums.com if it doesn't represent anything I asked for when I sent in the description. I specifically said no bright colors, etc etc. Obviously, the skin was made for a client long ago, and then when he gets lazy and doesn't want to do the work, he tries to sell it to his current potential clients.

I figure this is it, I just lost $3,000 to some whack job in Dubai. I tell him I need a refund for the last 2 skins (xbox360talk.com / csstalk.com) because I need to invest the money into domains. He gives a refund for those.

Now I go out and ask his past clients abouit this skin. They told me that he showed them the same skin which they turned down! I knew right there, that this guy...this is not my type of guy. I asked Sheldon, where is the logo? He said, "logo? I thought you were going to give me it?". I said, no, "I payed you for the logo...". He said "you did?". And I said "...?". And then he says, oh right you did! How can you possibly not know if a client payed you for the logo? $3,000 is nothing to joke around. Funny, first he told me he does skins based on logo, now he tells me that sometimes there's an exception to that. I know this guy is completely scamming me. He didn't even take a minute to see if I payed him for logo, he had 2 months for this 1 MOCK skin. Yes, mock, not even a complete.

I told him to refund for logos, he did. Now I had $800 left with him. $800 for the skin for sqlforums.com. I asked for a refund, he started going off on how I never trust him, and he showed me alot of attitude basically.

So what did I do? I had no choice. I had to confront him about EVERYTHING I knew. I explained to him how he blocked me and how my friend saw him online day after day when he lied to me that he was out of town for a family emergency of some sort. He lied to me about sending the emails. He blocked me when he said he was going to work. I told him everything, how he showed me attitude when I tried to help him, how the skins weren't made for me, how I have past clients confirming that he showed them that same identical skin. I told him everything, how he registered on a website of his client's on the day he was supposedly "out of town". I had him, but I hadn't had my money, and that was the problem.

His excuse? He has internet connection problems, and maybe he appeared on one person's MSN list, but not mine. Worst lie ever. I told him sincerely to refund my money and I explained to him why. He said he's done nothing wrong and that the skin was meant for sqlforums.com. He started talking about other things, etc etc. I told him, I want 100% refund. Finally he said, I can only give you 50%. We argued about the 100% refund for over an hour, he wouldn't agree. He said he'd send $400 out of $800 via Paypal. I said, I better take the $400 now before he ends up giving me nothing, so I said "okay.". He told me he had to get his friend to do it since he has no paypal account. I think his friend disagreed. So he had no choice but to refund the invoice on 2checkout for the full $800, since you can't refund a part of the invoice, the entire $800 had to be refunded. He agreed with me that I'd send him back $400 via paypal right after. I said "okay". He basically thought I'd be dumb enough to send back that 50%. As soon as I got my refund, I called 2checkout support line to see if all refunds went through. They said yes, and they locked the refunds so that he can't do anything to get that money back. Then I cursed at him, and blocked him forever. Since then he's been writing me emails and laughing at me, etc.

I learned 3 lessons in this.

1) Never trust anybody, no matter how good their work and past clients are. Like my friend said, vb skin designers never last forever. And when they got alot of clients at once, they "MAY" close down and you'll never see your money again.

2) If you are going to send somebody money for web work, make sure they are in your area, or atleast your country. Don't send it over seas.

3) Pay for one thing at a time. Don't order 3 things like I did.



It was a nightmare for me. But luckily I received all my money back. And from this day, I know who the snake in the vb skin business is.

04-29-2006, 05:45 PM
#15
kentmayne is offline kentmayne
Status: Member
Join date: Feb 2006
Location:
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 189
iTrader: 1 / 100%
 

kentmayne is on a distinguished road

Send a message via AIM to kentmayne Send a message via MSN to kentmayne

  Old

Originally Posted by ShytKicker
Please stay away from Vbulletinskinz.com. I had deposited $3000 to his account almost 2 months ago for 3 skins for sqlforums.com, xbox360talk.com, and csstalk.com.

First off, he kept delaying with just the mock design. Then after he couldn't get it done day after day, he just blocked me. I had a feeling he blocked me so I had a buddy add him to MSN and my buddy was reporting everything everyday. The guy has been on daily almsot 24/7 while offline on my MSN list.

I emailed him. No response. I emailed him again, no response. Now it was 3 weeks after mock design was due, and I emailed him a third time, saying he has 30 minutes to respond to the email. He responded saying he sent out the mock design the day before to my email address. I said, I never received it. This was such a dumb lie on his part, how can I get every email from his email address, and not get the one that had the skin. So I told him to resend it. He said it is at work. I said, what's the difference, log into your email account via Home, go to Sent Mail, and forward to my email again. He said it was in Outlook. (Another dumb lie because Outlook always has to be connected to a POP/SMAP mail account). He told me he'll resend it tomorrow at work, told me to be on MSN. I go on MSN the next day, he isn't online. I send him an email that night, and he said he sent it to my email account. I never received it. He said, "Oh, this time I brought USB drive with me home, so I have it on here, I'll resend it now". I said okay, resend it.

He sends me. What does he send me? An old skin he used for past clients that was denied, and he said it was purposely designed for sqlforums.com. This is the skin he sent:

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a3...Kicker/sql.gif

I asked him, why does it say Deuce Ace (past client) in the bottom of that skin? Where is the logo? Why is there a weight-loss sample banner? Why is all the text about Raw Food Chat (another past client). He said it was mock text, and that this skin was purposely made for sqlforums.com. I told him, how could it possibly been made for sqlforums.com if it doesn't represent anything I asked for when I sent in the description. I specifically said no bright colors, etc etc. Obviously, the skin was made for a client long ago, and then when he gets lazy and doesn't want to do the work, he tries to sell it to his potential client.

I figure this is it, I just lost $3,000 to some whack job in Dubai. I tell him I need a refund for the last 2 skins (xbox360talk.com / csstalk.com) because I need to invest the money into domains. He gives a refund for those.

Now I go out and ask his past clients. They told me that he showed them the same skin which they turned down! I knew right there, that this guy...this is not my type of guy. I asked Sheldon, where is the logo? He said, "logo? I thought you were going to give me it?". I said, no, "I payed you for the logo...". He said "you did?". And I said "...?". And then he says, oh right you did! How can you possible not know if a client payed you for the logo? $3,000 is nothing to joke around. Funny, first he told me he does skin based on logo, now he tells me that sometimes there's an exception to that. I know this guy is completely scamming me. He didn't even take a minute to see if I payed him for logo, he had 2 months for this 1 MOCK skin. Yes, mock, not even a complete.

I told him to refund for logos, he did. Now I had $800 left with him. $800 for the skin for sqlforums.com. I asked for a refund, he started going off on how I never trust him, and he showed me alot of attitude basically.

So what did I do? I had no choice. I had to confront him about EVERYTHING I knew. I explain to him how he blocked me and how my friend so him online day after day when he lied to me that he was out of town for a family emergency of some sort. He lied to me about sending the emails. He blocked me when he said he was going to work. I told him everything, how he showed me attitude when I tried to help him, how the skins weren't made for me, how I have past clients confirming that he showed them that same identical skin. I told him everything, how he registered on a website of his client's on the day he was supposedly "out of town". I had him, but I hadn't had my money, and that was the problem.

His excuse? He has internet connection problems, and maybe he appeared on one person's MSN list, but not mine. Worst lie ever. I told him sincerely to refund my money and I explained to him why. He said he done nothing wrong and that the skin was meant for sqlforums.com. He started talking about other things, etc etc. I told him, I want 100% refund. Finally he said, I can only give you 50%. We argued about the 100% refund for over an hour, he wouldn't agree. He said he'd send $400 out of $800 via Paypal. I said, I better take the $400 now before he ends up giving me nothing, so I said "okay.". He told me he had to get hsi friend to do it since he has no paypal account. I think his friend disagreed. So he had no choice but the refund the invoice on 2co for $800. Since you can't refund a part of the invoice, the entire $800 had to be refunded. He agreed with me that I'd send him back $400 via paypal right after. I said "okay". He basically thought I'd be dumb enough to send back that 50%. As soon as I got my refund, I called 2checkout support line to see if all refunds went through. They said yes, and they locked the refunds so that he can't do anything to get that money back. Then I cursed at him, and blocked him forever. Since then he's been writing me emails and laughing at me, etc.

I learned 3 lessons in this.

1) Never trust anybody, no matter how good their work and past clients are. Like my friend said, vb skin designers never last forever. And when they got alot of clients at once, they "MAY" close down and you'll never see your money again.

2) If you are going to send somebody money for web work, make sure they are in your area, or atleast your country. Don't send it over seas.

3) Pay for one thing at a time. Don't order 3 things like I did.



It was a nightmare for me. But luckily I received all my money back. And from this day, I know who the snake in the vb skin business is.
That was an interesting story, and like you said, you were lucky to get a full refund. He sounds like a bit of a sly player, thanks for the warning.

04-29-2006, 06:02 PM
#16
feros is offline feros
feros's Avatar
Status: I love this place
Join date: Mar 2006
Location:
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 742
iTrader: 3 / 100%
 

feros is on a distinguished road

  Old

Did you not use a contract? I keep a section in my contract claiming that if I default on a project the client gets a full refund. I really suggest not doing business with a designer unless they're willing to do this as well, otherwise you're opening yourself up to a scam.

04-29-2006, 06:55 PM
#17
ShytKicker is offline ShytKicker
ShytKicker's Avatar
Status: Member
Join date: Dec 2005
Location:
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 143
iTrader: 0 / 0%
 

ShytKicker is on a distinguished road

  Old

Originally Posted by feros
Did you not use a contract? I keep a section in my contract claiming that if I default on a project the client gets a full refund. I really suggest not doing business with a designer unless they're willing to do this as well, otherwise you're opening yourself up to a scam.
No I did not. After I viewed his designs and past clients, I thought it'd be all great. But after I deposited the money, his entire attitude changed. He had that attitude like he wasn't getting payed enough so he didn't care whatsoever.

Now I'll know to always have a contract. And it'll be with a company/designer that is USA based.

04-29-2006, 08:07 PM
#18
Bazza` is offline Bazza`
Bazza`'s Avatar
Status: Request a custom title
Join date: Nov 2004
Location: England
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 3,515
iTrader: 10 / 100%
 

Bazza` is on a distinguished road

  Old

It's strange isn't it? You'd think that once someone had managed to make a good name for themselves, and become "big", they would everything they could to keep it that way. I just don't understand why people do things like that.

04-29-2006, 09:04 PM
#19
echoepidemic is offline echoepidemic
echoepidemic's Avatar
Status: Graphic Designer
Join date: Apr 2005
Location: Vancouver
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 2,057
iTrader: 0 / 0%
 

echoepidemic is on a distinguished road

Send a message via AIM to echoepidemic Send a message via MSN to echoepidemic

  Old

I've only ever heard bad things about Sheldon.

05-07-2006, 04:07 PM
#20
P3RPL3XITY is offline P3RPL3XITY
Status: I'm new around here
Join date: Aug 2004
Location: United Arab Emirates
Expertise:
Software:
 
Posts: 11
iTrader: 0 / 0%
 

P3RPL3XITY is on a distinguished road

Send a message via MSN to P3RPL3XITY

  Old

Hi everyone, this is Sheldon from Vbulletinskinz.com. I usually do not go about posting on forums; however this post from Shykicka has compelled me to. To provide an overview of the situation, Shykicka aka Matt, has only provided a one-side to the story and made it sound like I’ve scammed him and run away with his money; when apparently it’s the other way round wherein I haven’t received my 50% for the time invested on the project. Following is how/since when we’ve been dealing with each other:

Matt first contacted me on the 28th of Jan’06 requesting a custom skin for Htmltalk.com. After exchanging several emails he came to a conclusion of actually hiring my service on 2nd Feb’06. An invoice was issued on the same day, via 2checkout, and dispatched to Matt; he cleared it the same day too. However, on the 12th of Feb, he sends me an email saying that he sold Htmltalk.com and would no longer need a custom skin, thus requesting a refund – Zap he gets it the next day – usually doesn’t take this long, but that week I had a lot of invoices to go through!

On 16th May’06, he gets back to me, checking if I still remember him. And on the 20th, he finally decides to have me design three custom skins for his respective domains: Sqlforums.com/xbox360talk.com/csstalk.com. He had some questions that needed to be answered, so we decide to talk about it through Msn on the 23rd. This time I made sure I sent him three invoices, each for every project, just in case he was to change his mind again in having them refunded. Matt also requested for a logo design for the three projects, so I decided to have another joint invoice for the three logos – we’re now talking about four invoices in total. He was given a discounted round figure of $3000 from the actual fee of $3300, inclusive of the logo design. Matt to this point is very quick in clearing his bills, I have no complains there, and he did clear all his invoices to stay par within the queue. After confirmation of payment, the client is put into the queue on the waiting list. Once the previous clientele projects are taken care of, I move on with the next client in the line. I then go about requesting the client to provide me a detailed descriptive briefing of his vision with regards to the forum design. The client would need to provide me the smallest detail of what he/she would expect in anyway possible – the more descriptive the client is, the better I understand in creating the design. Following would be Matt’ detailed brief:


Okay, basically I'd like the projects to be worked on in this order: sqlforums.com, csstalk.com, and finally xbox360talk.com.

I have 3 major rules though.

1) No dark-themed skins. Like gamesforum.com is dark-themed, I'm not interested in any skins that are dark.
2) No template-looking skins, for example something like domainhabit.com and domainnametalk.com is something I would NOT be interested in.
3) No small fonts. I'd like regular sized fonts used such as http://www.itfreaks.com/forum/ . Small fonts such as http://swishtalk.com/ is NOT what I am looking for.

Now first let's talk about sqlforums.com.
-I'd really love something that looks like http://www.itfreaks.com/forum/ . That looks like a very comprehensive design. That would be very nice.
-A design like http://dbforums.com/ would be nice too. I'd love to have something like itfreaks though.
-It has to look professional, so that it can be friendly for SQL Server/Oracle developers.
So I’ve got three pointers explaining to me the generic requirements of most of my clients. I did send an email asking for more info, but didn’t get a response.

Furthermore, I had mentioned to Matt that his project may initiate during the end of March or the first week of April. However, things didn’t go as planned due the humongous amount of clients I had, so I requested to have the design shown by the 12th of April. The day arrived, but sadly I couldn’t have anything ready, and I was frank with Matt telling him the same, and further requested to a next week commencement; I had gotten his confirmation on the 18th of April – so both parties were aware.

Things were so caught up with me, that I had forgotten to renew my domain vbulletinskinz.com. And it was Matt who gave me a heads up saying it had expired. Anyway, it was the 18th, and Matt contacts me saying it’s the day we start the project, and I go ahead and confirm what he says; 23rds is the day I have to send the mock design. But I send it to him on the 24th to his usual address of contact ShytKicka @ aol.com. This was the day I had to leave the city due to an emergency and I only got back on the 27th.

Once I get back on the 27th, Matt tells me he hasn’t gotten the design via email. Taken aback by surprise all I could tell him is that I could send it to him the next day because I didn’t have a copy on my local machine. He goes on in telling me if I could log myself into my mail server and resend it from the Sent Folder. I couldn’t do that because I download the emails on my machine, as I do not keep a copy of it on the server; neither do I have copies saved to my sent folders online. I use Outlook to download my mails and have copy’s saved in my Sent folder within Outlook. So the only option is that I go back and send it from Outlook Express. The next day being a Friday, a weekend here in our country, I rush to the office and send him the design and luckily make a copy of the source onto my USB. I return back home and towards the evening I’m being told that he hasn’t gotten the design yet. !?!!?!! I regenerate the design from my USB and send the design to him via Msn.

This is the first mock-design created:

www.vbulletinskinz.com/previews/sql.gif

Matt says “It looks good overall, but I don't like the red colors in the category space.” He then points out that why there was text from Rawfoodchat.com(a previous client) and a banner on Weightloss(a banner from my sister concern Bannersmall.com). Now the reason I have the table(printscreen) from Rawfoodchat is merely because it shows exactly the dimensions/spacing etc of a Vbulletin table with the type of content it may have and how accurately it may look, without me spending time to create layers in Photoshop to achieve such results. The banner being included, its just a random placeholder from bannersmall to fill in the space, thus to have the design look complete.

Matt then goes on about how he wanted certain things changed, mostly color changes; he had issues with the usage of Red/Yellow. And I give him the reasons as to why I think the colors are applicable based on the genre and the feel of the design. It was here the question about the logo design was raised. I had forgotten that Matt had made payment for a logo design due to the individual invoices created earlier. I did mention to Matt that a skin I create mostly revolves around the logo design to keep everything balanced and coherent. However, there has always been another point to it – a skin can also be created without a logo, but based on a specific model; in Matt’s case, his liking for ITFreaks.com. I created the skin for Matt, keeping my previous design(ITFreaks) as a base model. Clients like Domain Habit / Behind The Curtains / Game Banshee / Search Engine Forums etc were designed without having a logo on the canvas; they were added towards to end of the design process.

Anyway, as of right now, we had issues with the following
- Change bright titlebar colors
- Shift leftpanel to right side
- Design logo

And I get started with the changes; Suddenly Matt asks me the big question! “Did you design this for sqlforums or did you make this way before?” Of course I’ve designed this custom skin exclusively for Sqlforums based on the three pointers I had received. I could not have used another design from another client, because there had never been a situation when my design was rejected – I don’t have extras :P. I further went on about requesting Matt to be open about everything and tell me exactly what he wanted etc. Yet again, he requests me to refund the money to the last two projects, Xbox360talk.com and csstalk.com, and I mention to him that by doing so you no longer remain on the waiting list. He agrees to it, and the next second I refund the invoices. That done, I send him this revised design:

www.vbulletinskinz.com/previews/sql1.gif

He happens to like the new change but not as much; and he then asks if I could start from scratch.

It has never occurred to me until this day that a client has asked for a complete overhaul of the design I’ve created, so I put forward a scheme, like most designers would do by principle. I told him that I would create his logo first, and once you have that confirmed I would expect you to provide me a ‘detailed explanation of your brief,’ like every other client. However, if you do not like the design I create, after having the latest requirements, I shall have a 50% refunded back to you. The remaining 50% stands for the time invested in the project, as no project is initiated without a commencement fee. In addition, I mention to him that if you think I won’t be able to handle the job, you can request for the 50% right away. With no hesitation, he goes and request for a refund for the logos along with the 50%. I would say, it was his mistake to do so, because he had to chance of providing me a brief and me creating something along the lines. If only he could wait for a few days, he could have something worthy.

Closed Thread  
Page 2 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

  Posting Rules  
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump:
 
  Contains New Posts Forum Contains New Posts   Contains No New Posts Forum Contains No New Posts   A Closed Forum Forum is Closed